The Alan Sondheim Mail Archive

August 5, 2006

gloom room, tomb loom, doom womb,
weir fear, smear, leer, seer here,
hear dear, death-breath, lethe-seeing,
being we-ing, fleeing seeing, me-ing cost,
lost, tossed, mossed, fate late, sate
mate, hate great, rate wait, bait-girl,
curl, whirl, furl, churl hurl, dying trying,
sighing, lying, tying, flying, mime time,
chime rhyme, pace space, place-race,
waste, haste, taste paste, chastened,
hastened, fastened, battered, tattered,
pattered, prattle, chattel, rattle, cried,
tried, sighed, lied, tied, chide, bide,
ride, plied, guide wide, died, plead dead

Alan's words

I spoke, speak, divide, the path deride, write into night,
wryte into nyght, caught: pre-war history, pre-wars history,

oh for that memory once again, code-memory, memory of code, memory of
code of memory

here in West Virginia, crickets singing, they will sing beyond me
beyond my body's reach, arms', hands', fingers' reach
   a sudden gasp of breath, I will be gone
   my words broken, broken up
   used by strangers

some people
some people have other purposes
I wait for death like others wait for dawn
  wait for dawn's death, death's dawn, dusk of death, death of dusk,
  litany of beyond, storm-code memory,

who owns Alan's words
reorders Alan's words
claims them, takes them

even now, what comes out of my mouth is no longer mine


Text from Cybermind Conference - Log - 1996, Perth, Australia

Martin says, "we're close to beginning here..."
bree has disconnected.
Martin says, "What I would like is a discussion behind me on the screen
  with netsex, and I may be able to interact - I'll let you know when - you
t need to talk at all about this if you don't want, but it would
add/resonate w
/ the presen- tation which is going to be pretty chaotic."
Raxcip says, "sure, I will listen and play."
A very large pelican scoops bree up in its enormous beak and flies off to
her in bed.
Dria says, "um...I'll add stuff If I have anything to say (I usually do ;)"
Ghost nods.
Martin says, "stay on here - going off for about 30 seconds... - please
stay on
Ghost says, "Standing by.."
Martin asks, "hello?"
Martin sighs.
Martin cheers wildly.
Ghost smirks.
Dria does a little dance
Ghost stomps a rhythm
Raxcip asks, "just a cyber-type observation...  Does anyone else find it
odd ho
w easy it is to tell Alan from martin, even though they are sharing a
Alan has @joined you.
Raxcip says, "Welcome, Alan."
Dria says, "Personalities come across really well, I find.  Esp. if the
can write."
Alan says, "Im on as Alan now - and I think that Martin is on the other
Alan says, "Please hang in there..."
Raxcip says, "yes, I suppose."
Dria says, "hanging."
Raxcip says, "on"
Ghost says, "there."
Dria says, "stage fright :>"
Apocryphal says, "indeed, Dria..."
Dria says, "ah...I should get a gin&tonic."
Raxcip cracks open a beer...
Dria says, "brb"
Apocryphal puffs on a mellow cigar
Alan says, "Okay we're on - "
Martin reconnects.
Alan says, "Richard MacKinnon is going to type for me --"
Martin exclaims, "Whee!"
Dria laughs
Martin exclaims, "I can do the minutes here!"
Raxcip says, "it only seems like minutes..  Its hours."
Alan says, "Alan wants a minute by minute countdown."
Dria says, "okay, you're hired ;)"
Alan says, "Alan wants us to discuss what netsex might be."
Ghost drops its drawers..
Raxcip says, "I thouth we were byond *that* point..."
Martin says, "Alan went to "Hot Horny Bitches" because someone asked him
Alan asks, "What do you mean Raxcip?"
Ghost asks, "Not stimulating enough here?"
Dria says, "Well, the mind is the most important sexual organ.  Take away
all t
he other senses, and those which remain are heightened.  That's what it's
all a
bout. :)"
Raxcip says, "the general definition.."
Alan exclaims, "Hey Martin I didn't realize that you were here!"
Martin says, "Alan is talking about "wryting" as the ontological component
to w
riting ..."
Martin says, "Well now you do .."
Martin says, "We can take turns transcribing Alan ..."
Martin exclaims, "Netsex sounds ....  aaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh
m mmmmmmmmmm m m mm m m m  erghhhhh   h h wheeeeee!"
Dria laughs
zone has entered Conference Room.
Alan asks, "Dria . . . are you saying that mind-impoverished beings cannot
Martin says, "oog"
zone laughs
Dria says, "I find the silences during are more expressive :)"
zone loves it
Ghost exclaims, "Oh baby!"
Dria says, "mind-impoverished?  Uhm...yes, I guess I am."
Dria says, "depends what that means, of course"
zone cracks up
Alan says, "Dria, well then it seems to me that one doesn't need much of a
  to be silent.  Perhaps you should consider hooking up with a rock."
Martin says, "Alan is talkig about hesiataions and backtracking and
erasuresd .
Raxcip says, "Yes, Its interesting to think of the other when there not
Alan says, "Oh I see . . . then it's not the *silence* which is poignant,
but t
he thoughts resulting from the silence."
Speaker fades in from Entry Point and joins you.
Ghost says, "writing Alan talking about writing erasures.."
Speaker says, "I'll be Alan's words ..."
Speaker says, "Martin typing them ..."
Martin says, "yeah"
Raxcip says, "or, the silences translate to RL "
Dria says, "typing takes a certain concentration...if you're otherwise
, it becomes secondary :)"
Speaker says, "One case which resulted in netsex that recuperated a
married wom
an ..."
Ghost says, "Good argument for CUseeme.."
Alan says, "That's interesting.  Fanny, mentioned to me that the VR
  made on her--particularly the romantic kind--seem to linger into the real
zone manifests a spontaneously generated tatoo on her inner arm which
reads: wo
rds are sex
Martin says, "Sounds being recorded ... we'll put up the realaudio up
later ...
Dria says, "excellent argument for CUseeme...but that changes the
situation, re
ally.  It's not as much connected to becomes also visual."
Alan says, "Of course, this "lingering" phenomenon is often characterized
by si
lence, especially when a person has logged off."
Speaker says, "At times netsex can be completely overwhelming ... "
Goatium_Guest fades in from Entry Point and joins you.
Speaker says, "Part of it the 'command structure'  ..."
Ghost moans
Speaker says, "The ASCII unconcoous ..."
Speaker says, "ignore my spelling"
Alan asks, "If the mind is the primary sexual organ, then what is the
e between and physical sex?"
zone smiles
Dria says, "raw, digitized self, expressed.  It's very different."
Speaker says, ""I can't type half as fast as Alan, even though I do it for
a li
ving ..."
Raxcip says, " leaves you alone, untouched."
Alan says, "Hmmm....this implies that a virtual body is available to
virtual lo
Dria says, "untrue...emotions are of mind...I can be 'touched'
ten with greater effect."
Goatium_Guest has disconnected.
The housekeeper arrives to remove Goatium_Guest.
Speaker says, "text emerges as parts of past, childhood ... interjections
... s
natches that are not normally given voice to ..."
Dria says, "it's a more intellecutal intercourse."
Raxcip says, "Yes, but I decided I could no longer have netsex.  it left
me fee
ling too alone, too sad."
Alan says, "Yes, but even your desire to use the
"touched" imp
lies that a sort of "body" is produced-- whether emotional or textual."
Speaker says, ""Part objects .."
zone . o O (...duly noted use of the word "snatch")
Dria says, "it's not a replacement, but an enhancement"
Martin says, "Snatch was my word .."
zone . o O (...duly noted use of the word "intercourse")
Martin apologises.
zone laughs
Dria did that on purpose ;>
zone nods to Dria
Alan says, "Yep.  I think's that's true to a point...but it's even more
than an
  enhancement.  I think it is an alterate, but not necessarily one that
Martin catches the odd drop from Alan's verbal waterfall ...
zone smiles at Martin
zone loves it
Alan hands Martin a bucket
Speaker says, """The power of Netsex ... not trivial ..."
Speaker says, "Joining subjects across the wall of language .."
Speaker says, "defining ... truth ... idea of true speech and the genuine
Speaker says, "primordial objectivity ... "
Alan asks, "Dria, you said that you think the "touching" in VR is an
t of physical touching.  This implies that the former is better than the
.  Do you really believe this?"
Dria says, "netsex allows us to explore, to investigate, to
experiment...with o
nly minor risk, compared to's a new form of fulfillment...we are
only b
eginning to explore the possiblities"
Speaker says, "kant ..."
Speaker says, "Questions about Kant ..."
Martin exclaims, "Bucket!?!?!"
Alan asks, "What's a matter, Martin?  Is a bucket not large enough to
catch dro
ps from Alan's waterfall?"
Dria says, "enhancement...not 'better', just...different...often
it's something new, and powerful, which affects profoundly the lives of
many pe
ople.  It cannot be shrugged off as inconsequential"
Speaker says, "A state of primitive fusion and confusion .."
Speaker says, "Temptation of St Antoine .."
Ghost says, "No one's mentioned gender yet.."
Speaker says, "Cyberspatial buzzing .... huge amounts of ..."
Speaker says, "Excretion's featured a few times ... not that zone ..."
Speaker says, "not = note"
Dria says, "gender becomes ephermal...manipulable...part of the
zone nods to Speaker
Alan says, "Okay, I'm with you.  In the case of "worse," "enhancement" is
an od
d choice of word.  An enhancement which makes something worse
is a
connotation that is usually reserved for Microsoft :-)"
Dria says, "we are who we want to become."
Speaker says, "Confusions of identity .... @gender commands ..."
Dria laughs
Dria says, "perhaps it was a poor choice of word."
zone says to Dria, "I agree Dria...but I think it is also an opportunity
to bec
ome more *who we are* serving as a mirror..."
Speaker says, "Control faction ... moviong backwards and forwards from the
ss .."
Speaker says, "ss"
Dria asks, "what parts of life do *not* serve as mirrors?"
Speaker says, "tremendous sexualisaion of the internet as a whole ..."
Alan says, "No matter . . . I agree, though . . . the internet allows us
to exp
lore and experiment with reduced risk, but really though, how much of a
risk is
  afforded.  I know that people can really get hurt--which comes as quite a
rise to them."
Dria says, "it's the cultural restrictions which we ahve to deal with in
zone says to Dria, "You mentioned this thing about who we want to
I was noticing the opposite is also true..."
Speaker says, "Most non-moderated spaces show this ..."
Dria says, "that's why I said minor risk...the risk exists...the
phenomenon of
cyberrape...that cannot be overlooked."
Speaker says, "Sexualisation ... desires implicit just about everywhere
Alan says, "Precisely.  We can dump some cultural baggage, but I think
people w
ho think the is "safe" are a bit'd."
Speaker says, "16 minutes ... 4 to go "
Speaker says, "language loses its formal syntactic structure ..."
Dria says, "it's safer than rl, imho...injury is of a different nature
Speaker says, "Raviushment becomes the unravelling of language..."
Alan says, "There a plenty of cases where has penetrated the
interface and  and hit the user right where it hurts."
Speaker says, "Woman he knew who would short out the keyboard with her wet
  after coming .."
Speaker says, "Streams of characters ..."
Speaker says, "fbnu bgyf hgf hgf hf hgbfh jgthrjigbtrubigperhbubhuehtuig
  75ub4 htgb4 u5tgb4 5ugpbu4pihu5ughbu54ibgutbgubthbgubt "
Speaker says, "Ah, tht's better."
Alan says, "weroiusc sfdrmss sadfsdflj asdfsdj4r32wq"
Raxcip laughs
Ghost says to Dria, "psychological hurt is still psychological hurt"
Alan shrugs
zone says, "seroshlkjlllllll kisslillhh .lkjjiliiiiiiillllmmmmmm"
Alan says, "Exactly."
Dria says, "as I said, different.  "
Speaker says, "cu-seeme is more uncanny and disturbing  than y-talk ..."
Dria asks, "you really can't see the difference in risk?"
Speaker says, "Silence of cu-seeme ... uncanny ... uncomfortable ...
g ... becasue of the faces ..."
Speaker says, "faces erupt in different direction .."
Alan asks, "Is it possible that a face can be thought of as genitalia?"
Speaker says, "recognition ..."
Speaker says, "didn't get to death on the internet ..."
Dria thinks about Michael.
Speaker says, "Tomorrow: Michael Current's fdeath ..."
zone says, "le petit mort"
Speaker says, "Thankyou ..."
Speaker recieves applause ..
Raxcip says, "only insomuch as every part of the body is sexual, (faces)"
Dria applauds for Alan :)
Martin says, "Questions ..."
Martin asks, "?"
Speaker says, "... cleaning up ..."
Ghost goes out through the out door.
Alan says, "Stelar laughed at the notion of cleaning up."
Alan says, "=c"
Dria laughs
Alan says, "Apparently in Austrialia, Kant is pronounced "cunt.""
Speaker says, ""Jerry asks about Kant ... Alan thought he meant something
... talking about netsex ..."
Speaker says, "It is."
Dria bites hir tongue
Martin says, "probably for good reason"
Speaker says, "carry sexuality beyond what happens in Alan's real life .."
Speaker says, "as it becomes more real ... series of exchnages ..."
Speaker says, "list ... priovate mail .. ."
Speaker says, "more emotional .."
Speaker says, "relationshiop ..."
Speaker says, "phone call "
Speaker says, "phone sex ..."
Speaker says, "y-talk ..."
Speaker says, "photos ..."
Dria the first phonecall today :>
Speaker says, "peices of hair ..."
Speaker says, "souvenirs ..."
zone smiles
Speaker says, "anything ..."
Raxcip says, "sextoys..."
Speaker says, "Small animals .."
Dria laughs
Raxcip asks, "?"
Alan says, "Panties, panties"
Speaker says, "Oh yes, panties ..."
Dria says, "oh, don't forget the panties."
Speaker says, "That was a typo  . ..."
Raxcip grins
zone says, "oh yeah...and remember panties"
Speaker uses the word "coagulation" a lot ...
Alan says, "Effluvia and coming together in a matted position."
Speaker says, "Question intimates that Jerry ta;ling and Alan typing was
like G
ilbert and George ..."
Alan says, "Group"
Dria, time to break out the erotica ;>
Speaker says, "like dria"
Speaker licks Dria ever so slowly.
Alan says, "Except that the group is one person."
Dria freezes, deer in the headlights ;>
Dria says, "Yummy"
Speaker says, "Richness of "
Speaker says, "Turn off the computer ... left with own reflection in
screen ...
Dria says, "the mirror."
Apocryphal says, "..."
Speaker says, "Different movements ..."
Raxcip says, "yes, thats the part I hate.  The computer off me alone"
Apocryphal says, "or nothing...the matte, blankness"
Speaker says, "y-talk is like two bodies separated by
Dria says, "you just have to understand what it is that you're getting

Dria says, "but it is possible to get so much more from it...real love,
can gro
w out here."
Martin says, "Jerry's talking ..."
Raxcip says, "yes, of course. "
Dria says, "you sound unconvinced. :)"
Raxcip says, "My friend was a world away."
Dria nods
Dria says, "aye...I know what it's like."
Alan says, "One of the speakers is talking about how he enjoyed watching
the th
e screen and Alan and the timekeeping.  This, I (Richard) think is an
example o
f how affords a greater opportunity for voyeurism."
Dria grins
Martin grins
Raxcip says, "I find it hard to exist both here on teh net and in RL, and
  give oneself in either space.  I choose the Real."
Dria says, "I toggle between.  I am not real."
Alan says, "I choose both.  The unreal has been very good to me."
zone laughs
Martin says, "I really like Ari's presentation ..."
Apocryphal says, "it seems..."
Raxcip fails to delineate.
Alan says, "Jon Marshall is asking about the ethical challenges posed by
Apocryphal says, "like there's no one-or-the-other each infects the other"
Martin says, "The text was most lost on me ... but watching the images of
the h
ands was definitely affaected by the MOOD of the text ..."
Alan says, "Don't forget that the Cathoholic Church has decreed that is
  a sin."
Dria says, "I walk out into the world 'rl' and I is
surreal. all feels surreal.  I have realized that "I" am not real (to anyone
at least).  So why fight it."
zone exclaims, "!!!"
zone says, "That is astonishing."
Dria says, "you're not serious.  You *can't* be serious."
Alan is serious
Dria boggles
Speaker says, "Ari says even email is theatrical .."
Apocryphal says, "the screen as contraceptive"
Alan says, "Dria, I think in the long-run, this is a great development.
With a
  simple decree, the Church has given credence to cyberlife.  That's a good
Raxcip says, "the catholic church would never approve of fun without
Dria says, "well, yeah, but.  It's still stupid. :>"
zone nods.  Yes.  Calling netsex a sin has in one fell swoop brought it to
attention of the world...
Alan says, "Yeah, but I'll take a little near-sightedness with a lot of
-even if the vision comes inadvertently."
Dria decides to ponder it for a bit before forming a real opinon.
Martin asks, "Any questions to ALan?"
Martin says, "No"
Martin says, "That's it ..."
Martin says, "next sesion in 5 minutes .."
Alan says, "That's it, and thank you. There's another panel in five
minutes and
  I can possibly work this through as well - not sure what the situation
will be

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